I heard about this, last year.
"Smoke Creek Gathering will take place during the week of Burning Man (Aug 29 to Sep 5) on the beach of Squaw Valley Reservoir right next to State Route 447. only 17.1 miles NORTH of Gerlach, NV.
By contrast, Burning Man takes place approximately 12 miles EAST of Gerlach in the Black Rock desert. This new festival is outside the exclusion zone for Burning Man set up by the BLM.
This is the Smoke Creek Gathering.
Bring Your ART!"
Burning Man outside of Burning Man, in a place that looks a lot like the Playa. Tickets sold out last year, so "roll your own" looked like the way to go, until the evil BLM shut them down.
Or did they? I hear about a "closure and restriction" order during the week of the Burn, and am all ready to get pissed off at the BLM for being sleazy and squashing competition, but did they really do that? Skimming the report, what I see them saying is things like "no drugs, no drunk driving, no fireworks" - but does one have to have any of these things to have art or community?
Did the Smoke Creek organizers overreact and give up too easily, or did I miss something?
Well, if there WERE organizers, and they were pointed out to the BLM, they probably got arrested.
Organized events over 200 people are required to be permitted by the blm on the lands they oversee (including private lands). The Smoke Creek event was an obvious attempt to skirt BLM restriction on the BM event. So they wouldn't be kind about it.
Yeah, I don't know Jack Shit about this Smoke Creek crap, but that doesn't stop me from expressing an opinion.
That opinion is simple. To wit: For the week of the Festival, keep your Poo off the Playa. From Wadsworth to Winnamucca, the cops are everywhere, and it's open season on filthy Hippies like us.
They have dogs, guns, tazers, and absolute contempt for your clearly imaginary fourth amendment rights.
You have "Art", open liquor, some pot, naked underage runaway children, fireworks, probably some guns, and no idea just how cold they keep the cells down at the Reno Jail.
Just so you know, they keep the Holding Tanks real cold. The Jailers turn the Climate control down to Siberian Wilderness, and it's just plain miserable.
It's a big money week for the "Thugs of Authority" and the ones who can't get inside the Orange Hippy Fence and club baby burners, are left to mug anyone stupid enough to camp anywhere within the distance a vulture can fly in a day.
Look. It's a big desert, and normally, the cops really don't care. They tend to be nice people, and don't want to bother you
Go have your Avant-Guarde festival, just do it some other time of year.
You will be much happier.
Sorry Zaius, but the whole point of having an alternative to the alternative festival is so that you can show how little you care about the alternative festival, and you can't really do that effectively if you aren't ignoring the alternative festival at the exact moment it's happening.
"The Smoke Creek event was an obvious attempt to skirt BLM restriction on the BM event."
The BLM restriction was, according to the BLM itself, based on their concern for the impact a larger event would have on the parcel of land on which it was meeting, not on a desire to ensure that a certain number of burners would be thwarted in their attempt to take part in an event like Burning Man, so that's a non sequitur. Smoke Creek's site would have been located a good distance away from Burning Man's, even if the two events would have been meeting at the same time.
"Yeah, I don't know Jack Shit about this Smoke Creek crap, but that doesn't stop me from expressing an opinion."
No doubt, but just for giggles, let's pretend that cluelessness is a bad thing.
"You have "Art", open liquor, some pot, naked underage runaway children, fireworks, probably some guns, and no idea just how cold they keep the cells down at the Reno Jail."
Which gets us to a point that maybe it's time to consider: maybe Burning Man has outlived its usefulness. Maybe the ticket crisis that Maid Marian is worried could spell the end of Burning Man should be allowed to do its damage, and Burning Man should be allowed to die.
Look at your own response to as unrevolutionary a suggestion as just having the art somewhere, without the drugs or guns. You can't or won't process that, mentally. Your brain shuts down. If there's art, there just has to be naked people, fireworks and all of that, it just COULDN'T be any other way, end of subject. Really, if I had dropped by an LDS run retirement home and asked the residents to rethink that whole "Joseph Smith is a prophet" thing, I would have encountered more open mindedness. They might not have been willing to rethink their answers to the question, but at least they would have grasped that there WAS a question. You didn't even get that far.
Not that you're the only burner I've met lately whose thought processes seem to keep going around and around in circles that are tighter and more closed in every year. Which is my point. If Burning Man has become that hidebound, its community not just unwilling to tolerate deviation from the local Orthodoxy, but unable even to conceptualize it, then hasn't it become exactly what it was created as an escape from, in the first place - intensified? If so, why bother with it, at all?
I waited over two months to see if somebody, anybody, would do better than you and your sidekick did, and it didn't happen. So much for radical self-expression. What good does it do those who have nothing left to express?
Okay burnier than thou... Lets turn that back on you. Can't yoou imagine displaying art anywhere but the Norther Nevada Desert? Could you maybe do it some other TIME than the wee before Labor Day?
You don't know Jack nor shite about any of us, nor what we do/ live/ have for art.
Go back under your bridge.
No, not a non-sequiter. What's a "good distance" away? Have you thought about Cuddeback Lake instead? why 5 miles from the Burn?
Now come on guys, let's cut Deleted some slack.
We haven't had a troll in here, for months. If we chase him off, we're back to slapping monkeys in a big circle.
Well, it's a small circle, and Deleted is a low quality troll, but times are clearly desperate here.
I'll play his foolish game, but, I don't think the fudge that lives between his ears is up to the task of rising to the bait.
Delieted wants it both ways. He wants to be Burning Man, and at the same time, wiggle his twig at Burning Man.
I think the boy has Mommy issues.
My points are simple.
If you want to go hang your art in the middle of the howling wilderness, go fucking do it.
Edvard Munch ( You know, the guy who painted "the scream") did just that.
He took all his paintings, and hung them in the forest.
Until they rotted.
Edvard didn't need any Burning Man mommy substitute to tinkle upon.
Why do you? How full of lame, I want attention, where is my wet nurse attitude are you?
The reason not to go out to Black Rock that week, really is the cops.
Even if you are clean as a whistle, The cops have lots of hoops for you to jump thru, and any good cop can find a way to use his ticket book.
If you want to wrestle with pigs in the mud, be my guest.
You will end up dirty, and the pig will end up happy.
As for guns, drugs, and the underage Ukrainian underwear models that populate my life, it's just the way I live.
I never venture out into the desert, without oddles of the aforementioned items.
When you consider that I live in the desert, in the first place, dissipated hedonism is just another day at the office, for me.
Please keep your conventional, morally repulsive lack of acceptance off my body, my friend Svetlana's body, our Stud Unicorn's body,
and anything else, that I will ever look at, touch, or see.
"Okay burnier than thou..."
Let's note that this was addressed to somebody who has questioned the continuing value of Burning Man, by somebody else who is going into hysterics in response to the asking of that question. "Pot. Kettle. Black.", as the saying goes.
"Lets turn that back on you. Can't yoou imagine displaying art anywhere but the Norther Nevada Desert? Could you maybe do it some other TIME than the wee before Labor Day?"
Neither here nor there, as I'm not one of the organizers of Smoke Creek. You might have noticed that I was speaking of them in the third person. Go back and read the post.
"You don't know Jack nor shite about any of us, nor what we do/ live/ have for art."
How well do I have to know somebody, to read what he has written? If his words suggest a lower level of dedication to something he cares about than that which he actually feels, whose fault is that?
"Go back under your bridge."
Or you'll do what? Grow up and learn to read, Teddy.
"Have you thought about Cuddeback Lake instead?"
Have you thought about learning how to read? I'm not one of the organizers for Smoke Creek. For reasons that you and your playmates are doing an excellent job of illustrating, I don't invite burners to anything, any more. There's hardly a person to be met through one of these events who knows how to act like an adult, and in my experience, the few who do visibly cringe when they're called "burners". Whatever Burning Man used to be about, today it seems to be about heavy drug use, unimaginative groupthink, and an absolute lack of emotional self-control. These are not things to be admired.
I'm happy to give the organizers a few constructive suggestions, but that's as far as it goes.
This s weak sause and you know it. Yes your original post was about "them" but in following posts you spewed your own opinions to which I was responding. Can't switch fences that easily.
And when did I "go into hysterics". I will say again, the first one was SHUT DOWN, and the organizers probably arrested; for the reasons I stated.
If you're going to defend them, however, you'd better be able to answer the question.
Hey, who said the organizers of burning man are here? We never said that....
" today it seems to be about heavy drug use, unimaginative groupthink, and an absolute lack of emotional self-control."
And yes, that's what we keep telling people like you. Specifically, so you don't tell people like that they 'should come".
There, I continues baiting, ya happy?
Gross logical phallacies, fence jumping, personal attacks. this Troll better be worth it ....
his Troll better be worth it ....
No, I don't think he is.
This boy is nothing more then some skeezy art school drop out who cannot write.
So far, he seems limited to repeating anything anybody says, and then goes sadly off tangent.
Until we get some trolls of quality, we are stuck with amateur troglodytes like him .
What do you guys think about putting an ad in Craig's list?
Between the offers of midnight trysts with transsexuals and demands that we visit the Asian weenie scrubbing establishments,
There must be room for trolls to rent.
If we can no longer rely upon viciously clueless boneheads to fall into our hole on a regular basis, we may have to resort to the free market.
please continue, is all very entertaining....opps, I'm not acting like an adult...damn drugs!